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twice

Once in park. My dog was on a post (training to fix grips). Shepard cross comes over without owner and off leash and attacks my male. End result. Dead shepard. Crushed muzzle. I tried to sue the dead dog's owner for loss of training time.

Once in my yard. Loose dog come into my yard and attacks my female. End result. Broken leg. I separated the dogs before Ice could finish. Probably not the right yard to come into. :lol:

Moral of the story. Keep your dogs on leash.
 

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Luckily the dogs I have now have never been in a fight. But when I had a female pitbull mix, she got into 3 fights.

The first time, I'm walking her around the block and a dog runs up. Needless to say, he got to close and she jumped on him. I broke it up and ran the other dog off before it could get to bad.

The second time, the same thing...dumb dog comes up and gets alittle to close and she jumps him.

The third time, I was walking her and my brother came up with his dog (not a leash as usual) and she jumps him.

Everytime I broke it up before it could get any worse, as PeterC said Keep your dogs on a leash!
 

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Just curious and want to learn, Peter.....When your dog(your, in general) gets into a fight, and it was totally provoked by another dog, like the other dog attacks first or similar, what if your dog doesn't recall?? I mean, if you are yelling, using a break stick or choke collar or what have you, is your dog defying you calling for punishment because it did not listen to you to stop?I would never expect the dog to back down and get hurt just because I am having a hissey fit on the sidelines, however, should the dog know when enough is enough?
 

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My dog Chico was attacked by a black lab while I was out on a walk in my neighborhood. Anyone that knows my dog would have been speechless. He is usually a very mellow, somewhat shy dog. I always assumed that he would try to hide behind me if he were confronted. It was quite the opposite though! We were coming up the street and out of the bushes came the loose dog and just launched an attack on Chico. Chico didn't even hesitate, before I could even blink the two were on hind legs, in a snarling fight. I had Heidi and she was trying to get in on the action! Luckily my husband was able to get chico away by pulling the leash hard. The whole incident only lasted about 10 seconds, it was really scary though. The other dog must have realized he made a mistake by picking on a bulldog :wink: because he backed up and just kept snarling. There's no doubt in my mind that things would have gotten extremely ugly if my husband weren't there. We walked home in total silence and I was just shaking. Chico seemed totally unphased by the whole incident, it's weird.

After that I realized how easily someone could get caught in the middle of a dog fight. The whole thing happened so fast and the dogs are just so strong. Someone would have definitly been bitten if they reached in to grab the dogs. If that ever happens while I'm out on a walk with one of my dogs, I'm sorry to say but the other dog will probably die. There's no way I'm gonna risk my life because someone is too stupid to put their dog on a leash.
 

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Bogart has been in several fights. When Bogart was younger,
I used to take him to the dog park quite frequently. Then when he
got older, he started to get into some fights. That's when I realized
that he was developing dog aggression so I stopped taking him to
dog parks.

One time there was a husky type dog at the park. The dog
was muzzled which was a good thing, but then I also feel like if you
have a dog that needs to be muzzled, it probably means your dog is
aggressive. My feeling is that this still can create problems. Dogs send
signals through body language, etc. that can upset other dogs. Muzzling
your dog isn't muzzling their aggression thus you should still keep them
away from the dog park. Anyway, the dog growled at Bogart and of course
that set Bogart off and he lunged at the dog. We had to pull the dogs apart
from each other.

Bogart has also been in a fight with a few other dogs. I never really know
what set him off, but he'll start doing this posturing thing, he stiffens up, and
then just goes at it. I've always just had to pull him away. :(
 

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sajoseph said:
Just curious and want to learn, Peter.....When your dog(your, in general) gets into a fight, and it was totally provoked by another dog, like the other dog attacks first or similar, what if your dog doesn't recall?? I mean, if you are yelling, using a break stick or choke collar or what have you, is your dog defying you calling for punishment because it did not listen to you to stop?I would never expect the dog to back down and get hurt just because I am having a hissey fit on the sidelines, however, should the dog know when enough is enough?
IMO I think it's a lot to expect from a dog in the heat of battle that it will listen to you call it off or know when to say when on its own.

Paula
 

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My opinion is no bully dog should go to the dog park after 6-9 months. You are asking for trouble. No matter how socialable your bully appears to be there is going to be a situation where he or she will allow her instincts to come forth. And whether your dog started it or not it is not worth the hassle. Get the dog involved in an activity where they can use their drive to be productive and both of you can participate like sport work (OB, agility, weight pulling, protection, etc). Depending on what bully strand you have. You have access to the most versatile breed on the planet arguably. Find something it is good at and do it. But leave the dog parks alone for everyone's sake especially your dog!
 

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Tora has never been in a fight...Thank God!!!! I would have a heart attack!!! I am ordering a break stick to carry on our walks just in case though............Lots of irresponsible owners around here :evil:
 

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Sam is very good with signals, I know when he's getting up set and can pull him away from the other dog.

Storms different though, she's had a couple of blues with Sam when she first arrived and they sorted out their pecking order.Sam is boss and it's nice watching them play as Storm has even learnt to play more gently with Sam.

On walks twice off lead dogs have ran at her face and she has just latched on. My first responce is always to grab around her muzzle so she can not rip the other dogs face open. I don't place my hands near the other dog but once the other owner finally appears I use the choke method as well to make her release.
 

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Chopper was attcked by a Husky last year. My husband had him on his leash and the guy across the street from my Mom's house let his dog out. He went to put him on a tie out but the dog got sight of Chopper and charged him. Chopper took the dog down by the neck. Scott (my hubby) had to use the wheel barrow method to get him off. The guy held his dog and Scott grabbed Chops by the back legs and pulled. I guess it wasn't exactly a fight, because Chopper was just holding the dog down. The second time that happened, Scott plugged Chop's nose to get him to release his grip on the dogs neck.
 

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A cat came flying out of nowhere on a dog walk last week. Needless to say I almost booted that thing across the street but luckily (for it) he let go of my dog's face in time. Crazy felines. I hate cats.
 

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Re: twice

PeterC said:
Once in park. My dog was on a post (training to fix grips). Shepard cross comes over without owner and off leash and attacks my male. End result. Dead shepard. Crushed muzzle. I tried to sue the dead dog's owner for loss of training time.

Once in my yard. Loose dog come into my yard and attacks my female. End result. Broken leg. I separated the dogs before Ice could finish. Probably not the right yard to come into. :lol:

Moral of the story. Keep your dogs on leash.
This is the kind of statement I find shocking.

First up the Shepard. Let me tell you something a dog coming up and attacking without any signals is so rare its as well being classed as impossible unless the dog is insane. Dogs like all animals use visual and audible signs to compliment attack sequences. Flattening ears, raised lips, heckles up, dropped hocks, tight gaite, growling, tail curled down. If you are suggesting a high tailed happy looking German Sheppard just wandered across and attacked a Pitbull without any notice whatsoever im saying, pull the other one. Doesnt happen.

You are as bad as the german owner because you should ALWAYS be aware of whats around your Pit, what dogs are approaching and if you see any of the signs of aggresion you should have your animal to heel and under full control before it gets within 20 feet of your Pit. If you had done that the german would be alive.

If your dogs in the park and another dog can wander right up and attack without you knowing anything about it your are either an owner not experienced enough to have Pits or you are just plain reckless.
The Pitbull above all dogs requires responsibility and vigilance.
I have my dogs unleashed always in the park among many dogs and NEVER in my life have any one of them been in combat. typical dog encounters are short, direct and passing, in almost all cases the greeting and moving on between dogs follows the same pattern, if it becomes extended or one of the dogs looks to be beahving differently, call to heel and prevent any chance. Dogs will in 90% of cases make eye contact, pass to sniff genitals and bums and then make eye contact again before going on about their business. Thats a healthy encounter between two adult male dogs. An unhealthy encounter might be that one of the dogs stops still, his body is ridgid with head raised. Thats a warning position with the dog indicating his discomfort for the meeting and the possibility of attack if thing continue to be uncomfy for him.

You say you ae an experienced trainer and yet you failed in the most basic of responsibilities in allowing a possible aggresor to apparoch your adult male Pitbull and get into a fight while you were right there to prevent it happening. Sorry but thats not something to be proud of.

Second your yard.

Again, your yard was freely aceesible to any strange dog that might wander in from the street and yet you allow your Pit to be free from control??
If the yard is unsecure and dogs can access it you should be as vigilant as you should be when out with the dog. Constantly alert to the dogs and people around you and prepared to head of any encounter by swift recall and control.

Moral of the stroy Peter is that you need to be more careful and responsible with such a breed of dog. if it kills another dog its your fault for allowing it to happen, not the dogs for doing it. The owner should not allow such situations to develop in most cases its due to inexperience or lack of awareness of dog behavior and responding to situations before they develop into combat.

By the time your dog is an adult you should know his or her body language inside out and see any change in posture or stance immediately. This you learn from constant socialising when they are pups and watching closely to see your pups moves, signs and responses.

You should also be able to look at any approaching dog and have the measure of its walk, its earset, and have a general idea ofthe possibility of conflict. With a it if ANY dog doesnt look right to you, call it to heel and ward off the problem before it occurs.
 

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Re: twice

Knomad said:
PeterC said:
Once in park. My dog was on a post (training to fix grips). Shepard cross comes over without owner and off leash and attacks my male. End result. Dead shepard. Crushed muzzle. I tried to sue the dead dog's owner for loss of training time.

Once in my yard. Loose dog come into my yard and attacks my female. End result. Broken leg. I separated the dogs before Ice could finish. Probably not the right yard to come into. :lol:

Moral of the story. Keep your dogs on leash.
This is the kind of statement I find shocking.

First up the Shepard. Let me tell you something a dog coming up and attacking without any signals is so rare its as well being classed as impossible unless the dog is insane. Dogs like all animals use visual and audible signs to compliment attack sequences. Flattening ears, raised lips, heckles up, dropped hocks, tight gaite, growling, tail curled down. If you are suggesting a high tailed happy looking German Sheppard just wandered across and attacked a Pitbull without any notice whatsoever im saying, pull the other one. Doesnt happen.

You are as bad as the german owner because you should ALWAYS be aware of whats around your Pit, what dogs are approaching and if you see any of the signs of aggresion you should have your animal to heel and under full control before it gets within 20 feet of your Pit. If you had done that the german would be alive.

If your dogs in the park and another dog can wander right up and attack without you knowing anything about it your are either an owner not experienced enough to have Pits or you are just plain reckless.
The Pitbull above all dogs requires responsibility and vigilance.
I have my dogs unleashed always in the park among many dogs and NEVER in my life have any one of them been in combat. typical dog encounters are short, direct and passing, in almost all cases the greeting and moving on between dogs follows the same pattern, if it becomes extended or one of the dogs looks to be beahving differently, call to heel and prevent any chance. Dogs will in 90% of cases make eye contact, pass to sniff genitals and bums and then make eye contact again before going on about their business. Thats a healthy encounter between two adult male dogs. An unhealthy encounter might be that one of the dogs stops still, his body is ridgid with head raised. Thats a warning position with the dog indicating his discomfort for the meeting and the possibility of attack if thing continue to be uncomfy for him.

You say you ae an experienced trainer and yet you failed in the most basic of responsibilities in allowing a possible aggresor to apparoch your adult male Pitbull and get into a fight while you were right there to prevent it happening. Sorry but thats not something to be proud of.

Second your yard.

Again, your yard was freely aceesible to any strange dog that might wander in from the street and yet you allow your Pit to be free from control??
If the yard is unsecure and dogs can access it you should be as vigilant as you should be when out with the dog. Constantly alert to the dogs and people around you and prepared to head of any encounter by swift recall and control.

Moral of the stroy Peter is that you need to be more careful and responsible with such a breed of dog. if it kills another dog its your fault for allowing it to happen, not the dogs for doing it. The owner should not allow such situations to develop in most cases its due to inexperience or lack of awareness of dog behavior and responding to situations before they develop into combat.

By the time your dog is an adult you should know his or her body language inside out and see any change in posture or stance immediately. This you learn from constant socialising when they are pups and watching closely to see your pups moves, signs and responses.

You should also be able to look at any approaching dog and have the measure of its walk, its earset, and have a general idea ofthe possibility of conflict. With a it if ANY dog doesnt look right to you, call it to heel and ward off the problem before it occurs.
Thanks for saying that - and Peter's bragging tone in that post is just unbearable - he's pne of the reasons these dogs get such a bad reputation, as a pit bull owner you have to be ABOVE reproach, letting your dog kill another dog and bragging about it, saying blithely "keep your dog leashed" isn't going anywhere to help the pit bull's reputation. :shock:
 

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I have had to break up a few fights. A few were with loose dogs while I was walking my leashed dogs..some were fence fights.

Here is a copy from a previous thread on dog fights I wrote on how to break up a fight:
For future reference, here are some tips to break up a dog fight. Never yell at the dogs..this will only make them fight harder. Stay calm..you have a minute to grab a leash and/or break stick. If you are by yourself, tie one dog off to something..tree, door, furniture..anything to keep them in one spot. Next, leash up the other dog and either use a break stick to pry them off, or carefully choke them out by twisting thier collar until they release. Immediately pull that dog away so the other can't bite it and put it in a crate or separate area. Never pull tails, use water, hit or slap or yell at fighting dogs...this only encourages them to fight harder.

If you have at least two people, use the same above mentioned methods, but instead of tying a dog off, have the other person hold onto that dog. Do not be afraid of the dogs..get in there and get them apart.....a bulldog is actually an easier dog to work with in this type of situation, because a good one will not re direct and bite you..as labs, shepards and other breeds tend to do.

To KNOMAD: While I don't always agree with everything PeterC has written, I don't fault him AT ALL for his fights. I feel a leash law should be abided by ALL DOG OWNERS. I think it's terrible that I can't take my bulldogs out for a walk on leash due to so many loose dogs. My bulldogs don't start fights but boy will they not even consider backing down from one. Why should Peter (who RESPONSIBLY had his dog on leash) be at fault? You can "be aware" of your surroundings, but can't control what other idiots have thier dog's loose. Secondly, how do you know that the dog that got into his yard didn't climb or jump over his fence. I have seen dogs climb chain link and jump over razor wire to get into a yard.... most folks can't afford to put a top on thier entire yard...sometimes no matter how secure a yard, a critter can make it inside....know your facts before you accuse. Third, PeterC has American Bulldogs...not APBT's... while thier temperaments can be very similar, they are not the same breed. Lastly, I don't know how much experience with bullbreeds you have, but most bullies are dog aggressive... kudo's to you for avioding fights with your dogs, but don't give everyone false expectations that thier bullies will live peacefully with all other dogs.... Instead of bashing someone on this forum, why don't you give some helpful advice..the signs and posturing pre-fight, how to break up a fight, causes of fights, etc. [/quote]
 

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Knomad, PeterC can come off as harsh but he knows his dogs. How can you say that a dog cannot come up and attack without you knowing?? That is just ludacris. Ok, maybe some of the situations aren't actual ATTACKS but the end result is the same....a fight. And if my dog is on a leash and some SOB lets their dog run free...too bad for their dog. Yes, I would feel bad to see another dog get hurt but like my husband tells people "Hey, it's your dogs a**."
 

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Carrie said:
I have had to break up a few fights. A few were with loose dogs while I was walking my leashed dogs..some were fence fights.

Here is a copy from a previous thread on dog fights I wrote on how to break up a fight:
For future reference, here are some tips to break up a dog fight. Never yell at the dogs..this will only make them fight harder. Stay calm..you have a minute to grab a leash and/or break stick. If you are by yourself, tie one dog off to something..tree, door, furniture..anything to keep them in one spot. Next, leash up the other dog and either use a break stick to pry them off, or carefully choke them out by twisting thier collar until they release. Immediately pull that dog away so the other can't bite it and put it in a crate or separate area. Never pull tails, use water, hit or slap or yell at fighting dogs...this only encourages them to fight harder.

If you have at least two people, use the same above mentioned methods, but instead of tying a dog off, have the other person hold onto that dog. Do not be afraid of the dogs..get in there and get them apart.....a bulldog is actually an easier dog to work with in this type of situation, because a good one will not re direct and bite you..as labs, shepards and other breeds tend to do.

To KNOMAD: While I don't always agree with everything PeterC has written, I don't fault him AT ALL for his fights. I feel a leash law should be abided by ALL DOG OWNERS. I think it's terrible that I can't take my bulldogs out for a walk on leash due to so many loose dogs. My bulldogs don't start fights but boy will they not even consider backing down from one. Why should Peter (who RESPONSIBLY had his dog on leash) be at fault? You can "be aware" of your surroundings, but can't control what other idiots have thier dog's loose. Secondly, how do you know that the dog that got into his yard didn't climb or jump over his fence. I have seen dogs climb chain link and jump over razor wire to get into a yard.... most folks can't afford to put a top on thier entire yard...sometimes no matter how secure a yard, a critter can make it inside....know your facts before you accuse. Third, PeterC has American Bulldogs...not APBT's... while thier temperaments can be very similar, they are not the same breed. Lastly, I don't know how much experience with bullbreeds you have, but most bullies are dog aggressive... kudo's to you for avioding fights with your dogs, but don't give everyone false expectations that thier bullies will live peacefully with all other dogs.... Instead of bashing someone on this forum, why don't you give some helpful advice..the signs and posturing pre-fight, how to break up a fight, causes of fights, etc.
[/quote]

Let me clarify on thing, one owner being irresponsible doesnt make it right for you to be also. If you are with your dog in an area where other dogs are YOU are the one responsible for the actions of your dog.

Did you learn to drive a car? A good instructor would have told you NEVER to assume that the person beside or around you is a good driver or responsible and NEVER rely on that. The same applies for dog ownership. He was there and yet he allowed another dog come in and fight with his dog, the other dog died both Peter and the other owner are equally reponsible.

Leash laws are another way to encourage poor dog ownership. Many dog owners rely so heavily on the leash with pups they ahve zero to no dog control without it. A well trained dog is as easy to control off a leash as it is on a leash. It can be brought to heel as quick with a voice command as with a tug on the chain. The difference? The dog owner who can control their dog off the leash is highly responsible, prepared for eventualities in their dogs life and able to control them should they wind up slipping loose for any reason at any time. Its shows they put good time into proper training, control and work with the dog since puppihood meaning their dog is very unlikely to be running wild bothring anyone or anything because the owner is responsibly always with it and always watching to see whats around.

If a dog can run up and attack your dog right in front of you without you seeing it coming, you arent a good owner for this breed of dog because I can assure a dogs attack run is highly visible and easy to see coming for anyone whos looking around as you should be when with a dog in the park.

When I take my dogs to the park I look around first and take note of which dogs are there. I use the same park as I take them regularly as pups and I know the dog groups very well in my area. I know whch dogs are likely to be problems, which ones annoy my pups and which ones dont. If I see ANY dog I dont know or I dont like I make an effort to remain constantly aware of their location and the location of my dogs. Never the twain shall meet without me being firmly between them. I dont regard it as a job I regard it as my lifelong responsibility to the wellfare of my dog and to the welfare of others.

As for your talk about the yard. Rule number one about owning a dog is to know your breed. If you have a combat strong dog capable of harming badly with minimum effort not klnowing your own backyard is reckless in the extreme.

For Pitbulls, one of the very first things an owner should do BEFORE getting the dog is secure their yard if the dog will be loose there. Secure it WELL. Check all fences, know the jumping heights of the dog and ensure its territory is firmly and well sealed. Thats the one of the very basic rules of responsibly owning powerful breed dogs, so YES i can say hes irresponsible. He failed yet another basic rule of dog ownership when 30 minutes of his time and a couple of hundred $ could have secured the yard well and saved a dogs life.

I will happily give some advice to anyone who would liek to hear it, my gripe with Peter is that his attitude to owning his breed is very unhealthy imho and this type of owner does the breed no favours.
 

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Kasco said:
Knomad, PeterC can come off as harsh but he knows his dogs. How can you say that a dog cannot come up and attack without you knowing?? That is just ludacris. Ok, maybe some of the situations aren't actual ATTACKS but the end result is the same....a fight. And if my dog is on a leash and some SOB lets their dog run free...too bad for their dog. Yes, I would feel bad to see another dog get hurt but like my husband tells people "Hey, it's your dogs a**."
Well explain to me how it can happen then because I really dont agree with this statement. Theres no way it can happen that you shouldnt have been aware or prepared for.

The dog was running loose, as an owner its my responsibility to see it and to know its there. If an unknown dog is heading my way, again its MY responsibility to see that and be prepared for the worse case scenario. If a dog manages to approach my Pit and attack then i have been highly negligent.

I should have seen the dog, I should have known the possible outcome even if I wasnt experienced enough to read the dogs highly visible body language I could have erred on the side of cuation. Instead I allowed the dog in close to get into combat with a potentially lethal Pitbull that is under MY direct care and responsibility.

Sorry I disagree its nobodys fault but the owenr of the dog. You cannot own a powerful dog responsibly and go around placing the owness on other dog owners to prevent problems happening.

I cannot control other dogs I cannot control other owners and I am 100% aware of this, therefore its MY own personal duty to be prepared for that fact. What can control are my dogs and the immediate space around them, there I have full control and I can prevent any dog from getting close.

How do you stop a fight happening?Simple. Crouch down, place your body infront of your Pit, pull him between your legs and turn his head away from the trouble sheild him and his head from the dog you have concerns about, if its persists to advance and you have concerns. By doing this you will ensure your dog does not engage in combat because unless your dog is unstable it will never attack you for sheilding it off.
If you are afraid of the other dog biting you, command you pit to arms legth on the opposite side and keep yourself between the other dog and him, control him with your voice because if your dog is trained as he should be he will respond perfectly while not in combat. You then have the limited saftey of defending yourself from attack from the other dog while keeping your PIT out of it.

I go back to what i said before, dont blame the world around you, look at your own actions and the things you can directly control and ensure you take responsibility for those things regardless of what others do.
Should you have to sheild off your dog from an uncontrolled animal. NO. But that doesnt release you from the responsibility of having to do it, the world is full of situations like that and you have to do YOUR part right no excuses.
 
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