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I think i want to start feeding Nelson a raw meat diet. I hear its so much better for dogs than a kibble diet. and Nelson lurrrves chicken necks, frames and the pet mince i buy from the pet food store. He eats all of it including his kibble when i mix it all in. but if its just kibble, he'll eat a few mouthfull and he'll be done. I still think he's a little on the slim side and i know how much he loves his raw meat so i wanted to head in that direction. he's 11months now.

i wanted to ask if there is a special recipe that you have that will make the raw meat diet good for him and give him all his nutrience. the last thing i want is to start blindly on this raw meat diet and then he ends up not getting all the nutrience he needs to be a strong healthy bully.

any help or advice or yummy recipes would be greatly appreciated. thanks :D
 

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Do a search on it, there is a wealth of info out there on it.

DO NOT feed RAW and Kibble at the same time. They digest at different rates, the raw digests in about 6 hrs and kibble about 12 hrs. You can't have the kibble digesting and the raw stuck behind it. Feed them at different meals if you want to feed raw meat, just not together
 

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Bremner53 said:
DO NOT feed RAW and Kibble at the same time. They digest at different rates, the raw digests in about 6 hrs and kibble about 12 hrs. You can't have the kibble digesting and the raw stuck behind it. Feed them at different meals if you want to feed raw meat, just not together
Bremner, do you have any articles you could point me to about this? I asked the people at the training club said that it doesnt matter if you feed them together. They said it did digest differently, 14 hours for kibble, 4 for raw, but it doesnt matter if you feed them together. Who knows.
 

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I've heard other people say not to feed them together as well. I hate having conflicting information, it's so hard to decide what is best. Any info you have would be great Bremner because we just started feeding Loki raw. I can't believe I'm saying it, I never thought I would, I was scared about infection/injury from bones. But the owners of our club ground the raw meat/bones all together so I feel totally safe about the bones not damaging her trachea. All the dogs there have such nice muscles/great stamina/and for wonderful coats. It seems every time I see a dog with an exceptional coat (like Rocky & Layla, Tala) they seem to be feeding raw. I think part of it is the dogs with a lot of solid color fur show the shine very well. Loki LOVES the food. It's hilarious, she licks her chops like CRAZY when we are getting it ready for her :)
 

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Lokers, I know what you mean, its very frustrating when one person says one thing and the next a different thing. Just go with what you think is true.

I wouldn't be worried about Loki, I never had ANY problem feeding bones. I started off with Bruno and Digger, Bruno never scared me for some reason, I just never worried about it. Digger though I was so scared he would choke on the chicken wings, but he never has, and he LOVES them. I am not scared at all anymore. I never feed bones that are cut up. Like you can buy the beef neck bones for them to chew on for fun, sometimes they are cut up, I only buy whole ones or really big ones.

I love the look on their faces when you are about to hand them a big chunk of chicken, they look like they just won the lottery :lol:
 

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There was a post in the dog food sticky thread way near the bottom where someone linked a site that is a Rotty kennel which uses the BARF diet and it had a wealth of information. You can also do searches for BARF diets - there is a lot of info out there.
 

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when i first started feeding raw to remy i mixed minced meat and kibble together and she used to throw it straight back up
if your feeding raw need the secret is variety but with a main meat mine was beef cuts as the main food source i fed beef cuts daily and other meats around that fish once a week i learned to stay away from minced meat. find out where your abatoir is be ready for those early mornings cos they open at about 4-5am and sell most good things by 9am and shut at 10am how old is your dog? if its a puppy i used to get minced beef cottage cheese blitz it together and scoop the marrow out of beef marrow bones blitz that with it and add teapoons of water until its a nice consistency
 

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I have a question about this too. I am not planning on switching to raw, but was thinking about maybe giving him raw maybe once a week as a treat to see how he likes it. Is there anything I can get at the grocery store that would be good for him to eat? I am completely new to this diet and need specifics, I am just worried I will give him the wrong thing. Any advice?
 

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I posted a whole bunch of links somewhere here. Here I found it and I'll copy and paste it here:

A raw diet is very compilcated. Usually you would feed your dog raw meaty bones (rmb) with a 50% meat 50%bone ratio. Chicken backs, necks, and frames are very popular, as well as necks and ribs and other rmb from almost any animal. Generally people give large recreational bones and organ meats and tripe a couple times a week. Some people grind the bones and meat. Lots of people give raw veggies everyday with the rmb or ground meat/bone. Most people who feed raw don't add any grains to their pets diets, although some do. You can add things like ground flaxseed, kelp, alfalfa, dandelion, digestive enzymes, and yogurt. Also there are quite a few people who still feed kibble with rmb (just don't feed at the same time).

As you can see there is way too much to learn overnight. I wouldn't reccommend feeding raw until you've done lots of research and goined some groups to get help. I have been researching raw diets for over 3 years and I'm still learning. There are many great groups and sites for info on feeding raw.

www.njboxers.com/faqs.htm

www.lepus.reach.net/

www.shirleys-wellness-cafe.com/sampleraw.htm

www.rawlearning.com

www.barfworld.com/main.shtml

Plus there are many yahoo and different email and message groups and some great books out there.


I belong to some good yahoo raw clubs, there is lots of help there.
 

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kogeki said:
Bremner53 said:
DO NOT feed RAW and Kibble at the same time. They digest at different rates, the raw digests in about 6 hrs and kibble about 12 hrs. You can't have the kibble digesting and the raw stuck behind it. Feed them at different meals if you want to feed raw meat, just not together
Bremner, do you have any articles you could point me to about this? I asked the people at the training club said that it doesnt matter if you feed them together. They said it did digest differently, 14 hours for kibble, 4 for raw, but it doesnt matter if you feed them together. Who knows.

Bremner is right; you shouldn't feed them together because of the amout of time it takes to digest. I used to feed my puppies 1/2 and 1/2, but I stopped that when I learned that it takes about 12 hours to digest dog food. I started feeding the raw diet to my adult dogs several years ago, and I would never go back to kibble. For anyone interested in the raw or BARF diet, I would suggest you read any of Dr. Ian Billinghurst's books on the subject. They're small enough to read in a night, and the book titled "The BARF diet" has sample meals for a week in the back.

Here's what my dogs get twice a day:

1/2 a full size carrot a day with baby spinich crushed in a food processor. Then I add either ground beef, ground chicken, ground pork, veal, or chopped up lamb and mix that in the food processor, with an egg yolk for each dog. Don't feed them the egg whites, just the yolks. Sometimes I add fish oil to this mixture, other times I just give them non-smoked sardines in soybean oil. At least three times a week I mix in offal (liver, hearts, gizzards, etc.). At least three times a week I'll mix in some fruit with this too, usually apples or melons. All of this mixed together produces a nice rounded mixture that I use as the basis for the diet.

In addition to the mixture, my dogs get the raw meaty bones, which are probably the most important part of the meal. I mainly use chicken wings, which are easily crushed by the dogs jaws. You can also use chicken or turkey necks, backs, or just about any other part of the bird. I've heard of some people occasionally offering an entire game bird, such as a small chicken, or a quail. I use mainly chicken wings because the ratio of flesh to bone, and cartilage to fat is ideal in the wings. You can also use lamb shanks, lamb ribs, and lamb necks, but I've not had luck with Odie eating them. A lot of dogs will not eat lamb, although I have no problems with Tala eating it. I also give them each a chicken wing in between meals, and sometimes another after their second meal (so that's four per dog). Ox tails and beef ribs are also okay. You need to change it up sometimes; they shouldn't get just one type of raw meaty bone.

With their morning meal, at least three times a week I give them a little cottage cheese or plain yoghurt. This provides beneficial bacteria (live cultures). Also at least three times a week, they get either non-smoked sardines in soy oil.

Supplements: Both dogs get a multi-vitamin (pet pals), vitamin E tabs, and fish oil when they don't eat sardines. Kelp is often added to the diet because it comprises just about every mineral necessary. I don't use it because it upset every one of my dogs stomachs.

Other notes: It's important to crush up their veggies and fruits into pulp, because this aspect of their diet is meant to duplicate the the stomach contents of herbivores that they would eat in the wild. They don't really digest large chunks of veggies, and will pass them whole a lot of the times. Use green leafy veggies and whatever fruit is in season. Avoid nuts, onions, potatoes, and legumes (peas and beans). Also, too much of the cabbage family can cause thyroid problems.

Some say you can feed whole eggs, shell and all. I've tried this, as has my boyfriend with his dog, and they don't digest the shells. I don't recommend feeding the entire egg.

Raw meaty bones should make up about 50%-65% of the diet....lots and lots of raw meaty bones.

One of the key things to do with this diet is make it varied. You usually cannot provide a completely balanced diet in every meal, so you mix it up and make sure that, every week for example, they've gotten a full, rounded, and completely balanced diet. This means you feed different things everyday. Some days it's eggs and meat, other days its veggies and offal, etc. But, they need the raw meaty bones EVERYDAY.

Again, anyone interested in this diet should read the book(s). There's sooooo much more information in them than you'll find online.
 

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Oh yeah, forgot to mention my favorite BARF link, http://www.skansen.com/ (go to the nutrition section). Skansen Kennel has been breeding Schnauzers for over 50 years. She claims to have never once had a clinically dysplastic dog (her dogs, not the dogs she's sold or adopted out) on the diet. She attributes this to the vitamin C in the raw veggies and fruits. I don't know if that's 100% true or not, but she's had over 950 champion dogs, and she swears by the diet. I've seen her dogs in person; they're amazing! Simply amazing dogs, and they're lifespans are longer than the average.
 

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That's awesome info Beetle. I haven't had much time lately to post, so I have to be quick. I Have a couple more links to add, Esmond's are Rotty breeders who feed barf and they list examples of their diet: www.esmondrott.com/BARF_diet
Also this is a online book, and if you want to print it you can make a donation: www.pet-grub.com Mind you I don't feed exactly like they do. They say not to give bones, which I do. But it is a good read anyway. Also like Beetle suggested, Dr. Ian Billinghurst's books are the best. I would probably start out with Give Your Dog A Bone.

As for eggs, I only use free range. I have always read and heard to give your dog the whole egg. If you put it in the food processor it should grind up the shell very fine. The shell is the best part of the egg. Jazmine can't have eggs, but on the occassion that I don't think she's getting enough bone, I have egg shells that I put in a coffee grinder and are like a fine dust. I add those to her meal if I think she's lacking bone.

I go out and buy my veggies when I see a good sale. Usually about twice a week I make a huge batch of veggie slop. I use mostly green leaffy veggies, with carrots, turrnips, squash, pretty much any veggies, but the dark green ones make up the majority. I add garlic and sometimes I add fruit, then I mix it all in the food processor. Then I freeze it into daily portions. I do the same with my meat. If Jazmine gets ground pork, I give her something like pork hocks later, or if she's eating ground lamb, she gets lamb breast bone later. If she for some reason doesn't get a rmb, that's when I supplement with the egg shells. I try to make sure she has a 50%/50% meat bone ratio. Jazmine cannot have poultry, so it makes it a bit harder. She used to though and she cannot eat the wings (and smaller necks) because they are too small. For big dogs who are gulpers I would use chicken backs and frames.

I give Jaz offal twice a week. She gets a mixture of grass fed green tripe, heart, lungs, and organ meat in place of lamb, pork, or venison. Then later on she gets to enjoy a rec bone.

I also add yogurt (I've started making my own), ground flaxseed, kelp, and alfalfa to each meal.

A lot of people add digestive enzymes to their pets food, but I do not.

If you get your meat/veggies from somewhere and you're not sure if they're free range or organic (or if you're worried about digestive problems, or contamination) you can soak them in about 6 oz of distilled or purified water to a few drops of grapefruit seed extract. Pour over meat and/or veggies. If ground meat mix it in and it wil be absorbed. If you're using it on whole meat/bone or veggies just spray it on.
 

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Oh yeah, like Care said, garlic is also good every now and then. It's a great antioxidant. I forgot to mention also that they need recreational bones as well, at least a couple times per week. They get a lot of meat and bone and some marrow from them, and it cleans their teeth. The teeth cleaning is very important because in general, the raw diet is softer than kibble and does nothing for the teeth without the recreational bones, like soup bones, knuckle bones, and the type they just knaw on for hours.

And be sure to use free range eggs. They're usually brown eggs, and it will say they're free range on the package. This is because your dog is getting whatever nutrients the chicken that produces the egg has eaten, which is far more varied and nutritious when they eat free range.
 

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people go on like its so scientific and hard . its not one bit feed them like you would a child ( feed what you think is enough)
YOU'LL GET THE SIGNS WHEN IT COMES OUT THE OTHER END it should be firm and the dog should look healthy.
you know when a kid looks healthy,dont you.
 
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