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I would like to open up the topic of rescue versus buying from breeder when getting a new dog.

I personally have stated on a number of occasions that I will always rescue. I think if you are getting a pet ONLY, there is no reason one would need to pay thousands of dollars for a purebred dog. If one is looking to show or work then I feel they have a good reason to want a proven dog. I love my rescues and could give a crap where they come from or who their parents were.
 

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I used to totally agree with you steph. Not so much anymore.

When looking for a pet do I on some moral level think people should rescue? Yeah sorta. But honestly if they want a purebred, I don't really care. It's their dog and their choice.

For work, I will get dogs from breeders. Whether or not I buy them is irrelevant.

Eta: out of 4 dogs my single rescue is the second most expensive. Interesting huh?
 

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If you want a dog that lives up to it's breed description then your better off going with the pedigreed dog. Sure you can find dogs that look the part but it's a huge crap shoot at best. No ancestors to research potential health or temperament issues. Virtually no recourse when you get a crapper. Sure I've got $4200 vested in 3 dogs but the last 2 I got were free.
 

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I don't breed or work dogs. But when I do get a dog I look mostly for health and temperament. Because Colby is my first dog not bought by parents, it made me nervous to get a rescue. Knowing what I know now, I would probably rescue from a local group I follow. I would also want to rescue a dog who had been I'n foster care so I knew a bit about temperament etc.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I used to totally agree with you steph. Not so much anymore.

When looking for a pet do I on some moral level think people should rescue? Yeah sorta. But honestly if they want a purebred, I don't really care. It's their dog and their choice.

For work, I will get dogs from breeders. Whether or not I buy them is irrelevant.

Eta: out of 4 dogs my single rescue is the second most expensive. Interesting huh?
I do agree that well bred dogs are more healthy. However, the average pet owner usually doesn't know what to look for in a breeder. A guy jon works with bought his two boxers from a pet store called "Puppyworld". If he did any amount of research before buying his dogs, he would have chosen rescue over a pet store dog. I can't even count on both hands how many times I have spoken to people who don't know their ass from their elbow let alone how to properly manage a dog (ie hygiene, health, temperament), yet insists on purchasing their dog from a breeder. Why? What are you doing with this dog thats so important that you need it to be perfect? My mom got her dog from a rescue. He's nervy, but she hasnt had ANY health problems with him. She takes excellent care of the dog and hes in great condition. So my problem with some people that insist on buying from a breeder is that they dont even know what the hell to look for in the first place. They usually just go with the cheapest or cutest or closest one with no regard to the legitimate reasons one would go to a breeder in the first place. Here on BDB, most of us know better. But lets be honest, how many other dog owners out there are like us?
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
If you want a dog that lives up to it's breed description then your better off going with the pedigreed dog. Sure you can find dogs that look the part but it's a huge crap shoot at best. No ancestors to research potential health or temperament issues. Virtually no recourse when you get a crapper. Sure I've got $4200 vested in 3 dogs but the last 2 I got were free.
I don't care about my dog living up to its breed description. An OEB has so many description out there anyways, its impossible to know which one is correct anyways.

I do understand everyone, no matter how dumb the reasoning is, to own a proven dog. Why do I need papers? So I can show them to the neighbors across the street? Who the hell cares? I do understand the health and temperament concerns people have with rescues. But A) you dont have to go into the pound and pick out a dog in ten minutes. There are rescue groups with fostered dogs that you can see what the temperament is like right off the bat. B) As far as health problems go with bully breeds- they all can have problems. How many people have been on here that paid 2500 for a dog with cherry eye and hip dys., and allergies and the whole nine yards? We can say "oh they went to a crappy breeder" and that may be true but the truth remains "they went to a BREEDER".

I'm exhausted and can't even think straight right now, but I am interested to hear what will be said. And remember, everyone is entitled to their own opinion. Diversity makes the world go round. And im done..........:dontknow:
 

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A lot of people want a puppy, not a full grown dog. I think it's definitely easier to find a puppy from a breeder then a rescue. Now that I know how to navigate rescues to see the incoming dogs, it really isn't hard to find a puppy from a rescue. I think that is a common misconception of rescues though- that they often only have full grown dogs.
 

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If you don't care about a dog living up to its breed description then why bully breeds? why not a toy poodle or a lab.

I care about my dogs living up to their breed description, that's why I choose one breed over another. Its really the only difference between domestic dogs... temperament/structure/appearance/health. You want those to be what you are expecting with a breed, or you wouldn't care what breed of dog it is (or resembles)

Its a big reason why dogs are taken to shelters, because they are not what the owner expected they are not living up to their breed description and its the fault of the breeder focusing on a color pattern over a temperament trait.

If 95% of dogs were what the owner was expecting and prepared for then we wouldn't have these shelter problems in North America.

I personally would not buy a strong breed (puppy or adult) from a rescue, I can't risk have a strong powerful dog with a genetic faulty temperament.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
If you don't care about a dog living up to its breed description then why bully breeds? why not a toy poodle or a lab.

I care about my dogs living up to their breed description, that's why I choose one breed over another. Its really the only difference between domestic dogs... temperament/structure/appearance/health. You want those to be what you are expecting with a breed, or you wouldn't care what breed of dog it is (or resembles)

Its a big reason why dogs are taken to shelters, because they are not what the owner expected they are not living up to their breed description and its the fault of the breeder focusing on a color pattern over a temperament trait.

If 95% of dogs were what the owner was expecting and prepared for then we wouldn't have these shelter problems in North America.

I personally would not buy a strong breed (puppy or adult) from a rescue, I can't risk have a strong powerful dog with a genetic faulty temperament.
I feel that is completely false. People buy dogs because they are cute and fluffy and get rid of them because they don't have anymore time for them. I have known so many people that just got married and they want to wait for children but decide to get a dog instead. 2 years down the road, they have kids and don't have time to walk, play with, or spend time with the dog. The dog becomes restless, bored, lonely and start causing problems. So, they get rid of it. I highly doubt that shelters are filled up because a breed didn't fulfill an expectation. Most people don't even know what their breed expectation is. And who makes up these expectations? Some people have ridiculous expectations for dogs. They are not cats. They need attention, guidance, and love. Its not the dogs fault the owner didn't put the required time or energy into the dog.

I think a huge mistake lots of dog owners make as well is getting dog for their kids. KIDS CANNOT PROPERLY CARE FOR DOGS BY THEMSELVES. They do not have the sense of responsibility it takes to do that. A child can barely remember to brush his teeth, let alone look out for the welfare of his or her own puppy. Parents make this mistake A LOT and the kid ends up losing interest and bye bye doggy.

If dogs could take care of themselves, the shelters wouldn't be filled up like they are. But they can't and people don't seem to realize this. We created the domestic dog to depend on humans. When we give up on them, they cannot survive.

Oh and good shelters do temperament testing before putting dogs up for adoption. The ones with faulty temps are put down. Maybe I should give Lucy back and have her put down because she could become really viscous! And bite my head off in my sleep.

Sarah, if im not mistaken, your mastiff breed is a mix of some kind. Hows his temperament?
 

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Much like cars, and clothing, I will not buy "used". I'll always get my cats from shelters/rescues, but when I'm purchasing a dog, I want something that is solid and stable (or at least has the better potential coming out of the gate). Especially after all we've learned from buying Atticus, we now know what to hopefully look for. I can not take the chance that an animal I rescue will be sound (sure, they do temperament testing, but I take NO STOCK in them/that). I've seen tons of great rescues, but the few nutball ones ruin it for the rest. Right now my cousin has a ticking time bomb of a rescue on her hands, what's worse is she won't listen to anyone out of spite, and it's going to hurt her children. I can't take that chance with mine.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
The whole children thing is an interesting one. I am not disagreeing with you adrienne, as I do not have children and I don't know how I would feel when I do have children. And I agree when you mix bully breeds and babies, it can become dicey.

I do wonder though how many people claim they can't trust their rescue bully or any breed for that matter around their children and how many actually just know how to manage children with dogs. They let the kid torture the dog to no end and they first growl they hear its death to Fido.

I am 100% on board with euthanizing HA dogs. Its not good for anyone. But how many dogs become HA after children are introduced? Some? None?
 

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The whole children thing is an interesting one. I am not disagreeing with you adrienne, as I do not have children and I don't know how I would feel when I do have children. And I agree when you mix bully breeds and babies, it can become dicey.

I do wonder though how many people claim they can't trust their rescue bully or any breed for that matter around their children and how many actually just know how to manage children with dogs. They let the kid torture the dog to no end and they first growl they hear its death to Fido.

I am 100% on board with euthanizing HA dogs. Its not good for anyone. But how many dogs become HA after children are introduced? Some? None?

I think you mix ANY dog and children, it's dicey.

We took a really good class prior to ever having the kid about how to deal with dogs and children. A lot of the information presented was what we already knew, but it was amazing what the "average" dog owner doesn't know/think of.

And I digress, I think that the rescue thing just isn't FOR me. Regardless of children. But ESPECIALLY now that I DO. Perhaps one day, if I went in and just fell in love with the perfect dog, and could read it to the best of MY abilities, I would (I'm not saying I'm steadfast 110% NOT ever going to rescue). It's just not for me NOW. Or in the foreseeable future (I suppose if this is something I go against my word on, it's not a BAD thing). ;)

Oh, and with regards to the cousin and her children...it's not the children that are going to cause it to snap...it's a dominant dog that has no rules and guidelines, and snaps at anyone who attempts to get it to do "the right thing".
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
I think you mix ANY dog and children, it's dicey.

We took a really good class prior to ever having the kid about how to deal with dogs and children. A lot of the information presented was what we already knew, but it was amazing what the "average" dog owner doesn't know/think of.

And I digress, I think that the rescue thing just isn't FOR me. Regardless of children. But ESPECIALLY now that I DO. Perhaps one day, if I went in and just fell in love with the perfect dog, and could read it to the best of MY abilities, I would (I'm not saying I'm steadfast 110% NOT ever going to rescue). It's just not for me NOW. Or in the foreseeable future (I suppose if this is something I go against my word on, it's not a BAD thing). ;)

Oh, and with regards to the cousin and her children...it's not the children that are going to cause it to snap...it's a dominant dog that has no rules and guidelines, and snaps at anyone who attempts to get it to do "the right thing".
Would you feel different if it was a dog that had been in foster care with other dogs and children for some time?
 

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Would you feel different if it was a dog that had been in foster care with other dogs and children for some time?

Honestly, this ISN'T about children. I would feel this way about rescues without a kid. It's just HEIGHTENED now that I have a kid. Make sense?


Again, it's just like clothes and cars to me, I want something that's MINE. Something new, and shiny, and unfortunately, that means puppy breath. Something I can raise as my own, from the start.
 

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I don't trust shelters either, I have worked with them and most of the people heavily involved see things through rose colored glasses. They will do anything to save a dog, even a dangerous one.

My mastiff has an OK temperament, she is for the most part what a mastiff should be but she has a nervous streak (not enough to make her dangerous), but she is a good example why I would not risk a dog without viewing the background of the dog again.

Its the breeders job to weed out the uneducated buyers, if a buyer does not have realistic expectations of a dog or does not even understand the temperament traits then they shouldn't have one.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
I don't trust shelters either, I have worked with them and most of the people heavily involved see things through rose colored glasses. They will do anything to save a dog, even a dangerous one.

My mastiff has an OK temperament, she is for the most part what a mastiff should be but she has a nervous streak (not enough to make her dangerous), but she is a good example why I would not risk a dog without viewing the background of the dog again.

Its the breeders job to weed out the uneducated buyers, if a buyer does not have realistic expectations of a dog or does not even understand the temperament traits then they shouldn't have one.
No. It is the REPUTABLE breeders job to do that. How many of those are there exactly? And where do shelter dogs come from? Sure some come from accidental breeding or strays, however, surrendered dogs do come from families that purchased from a breeder. From a good one? Who knows.

Personally, I think its a crapshoot with any dog, breeder or rescue. There are bad apples everywhere. But I enjoy managing and shaping my dogs. I put in the effort and so far have gotten good end results. My entire family has rescue dogs. We have had no problems thus far.

To me its a shame that people can get things that are "shiny and new" screw them up because they are lazy and don't care, and then throw them away. Then its up to others to pick up the pieces, some of which cannot be put back together again.

I dont think shelters are against reputable breeders. Why would they be?

If we didn't have shelter or rescues, where would all the dogs go? People would keep breeding. BYB's wouldnt stop, puppy mills wouldnt stop. So where would all the dogs go I wonder?
 

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rescue dogs have a place, its just not with me.

there are many people who love a broken dog and will go to the ends of the earth to fix them, that's fine if that's what floats their boat but it doesn't float mine.

Breeders producing less then favorable dogs would not be doing it if they didn't have buyers, so its a cycle that will continue as long as people keep accepting "less than" with the dogs they own and puppies they buy.
 

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If we didn't have shelter or rescues, where would all the dogs go? People would keep breeding. BYB's wouldnt stop, puppy mills wouldnt stop. So where would all the dogs go I wonder?

I don't see anyone stating that rescues shouldn't exist. Just giving personal opinions on whether they would adopt a shelter/rescue dog. And why.

Unfortunately, there should be more stringent rules and restrictions placed on ALL shelters, IMO, with regards to WHO can adopt, their backgrounds, as well as the employees that are evaluating and handling the animal. But, there isn't enough time in the day, or money.
 

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Breeders producing less then favorable dogs would not be doing it if they didn't have buyers, so its a cycle that will continue as long as people keep accepting "less than" with the dogs they own and puppies they buy.
I don't think it's people accepting less than, it's people not being informed to KNOW they are accepting less than. Until ALL the people in this world who want a dog jump in, and learn, that cycle will continue (and lord knows that just ain't gonna happen, right?). And I don't begrudge them for it, they don't know any better.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
I don't think it's people accepting less than, it's people not being informed to KNOW they are accepting less than. Until ALL the people in this world who want a dog jump in, and learn, that cycle will continue (and lord knows that just ain't gonna happen, right?). And I don't begrudge them for it, they don't know any better.
Agreed.
 
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